Simulation Networking

[hughes407]

With the euphoria and anticipation being generated by the upcoming release of RW3, I have been thinking about where we need to be heading in the future - specifically, the networking of simulations into an interactive mega-sim. RSC seems to be committed to moving the RailWorks game forward and they may already have some concepts on the drawingboard. The RailWorks community and RSC have already shown an enthusiasm for working together to produce a superior product as evidenced by the NEC release, so I think we should try to establish a framework early on that defines which of potentially many networking approaches would best serve the community.

I believe the technology is pretty much in place to allow a number of discrete RailWorks simulations to communicate interactively. The difficulty would be in the design and implementation of the infrastructure necessary to allow information to be passed across the network. The military has been using this concept, on a far grander scale, to link simulations together through the Distributed Interactive Simulation (DIS) and High-Level Architecture (HLA) protocols for many years. Simplistically, these protocols define what and when information needs to be broadcast from a discrete simulation to the networked community so other simulations can correctly show the state of that entity and react to it.

I hope that other members of the community take the time to envision what they would like to see in such a network, within the bounds of practicality. Hopefully, these discussions will provide RSC with some concrete ideas to consider in their future plans.

Don

[hughes407]

My vision of a RailWorks interactive network would be to establish a virtual version of a medium to large model railroading club. This should include the ability to establish dispatchers, yardmasters, mainline cabs, local cabs, etc. These roles would be filled by those participating in the networked simulation. There is no reason why has to be a cast of thousands. Two or three people could do this together or a whole crew of a dozen or more playing every position.

Some, but by no means all, characteristics that come to mind are as follows. The players would operate in Free Roam mode but would not have control over automatic switches if a dispatcher is included as a participant. The dispatcher would have a super-2D map function to be able to visualize the gaming area and control routing and signals. Yardmasters would have similar control over their domain. Scenarios would be limited to initial placement of rolling stock and the scenario instructions would become a list of events to take place for each participant. If there are fewer drivers than trains to be run, some trains can be assigned AI status and would operate as they normally would, probably on the "Server" computer, for lack of a better word.

The server computer would track the location of all entities only when they are moving and would broadcast that information only when they get within a pre-determined distance of one of the player trains. Similar to LOD's, the transfer rate would start slow, say 1/sec, and pick up as the object gets closer to a player's location. This would keep the bandwidth down while allowing relatively smooth movement when the player passes another moving train.

There would have to be a voice or text function to allow communication between the participants. And, of course, there has to be an emergency freeze for us old geezers to get an unplanned potty break.

These are some thoughts from a couple hours of brainstorming. I don't want to trivialize this as it won't be easy. However, I have confidence that RSC has the know-how to accomplish something this complex. I'm sure that there are many other concepts that others will visualize that are totally different from this and I hope this thread can be a place to get them into the open for all to review and discuss.

Don

[MattW]

One way to do it might be to let servers run a perpetual world. Then, users can hop in and out of trains as needed with AI handling movements of non-player trains. This actually is similar to what another poster either here or on Uktrainsim was talking about with career mode: a persistent world (active or not) that holds a timetable and lets you control specific trains at specific times.

[TrainMaster1]

Gentlemen:

We already have such a group in place. We are entering our second year of running Prototype Operating Sessions on sim railroads all over US and Canada. We have trained dispatchers, yardmasters, maintenance of way, engineers, conductors, train masters and more. Our system will work on any simulator as it is not dependent upon the sim but rather the quality of the route (must be a close approximation of a Class One route) and the quality of the people involved.

All of our engineers go thorough an qualification and training program since we do follow the rule book for every road we run upon. We supply all train info (symbols, car count, weight, length. load and empty counts and more) in every session we run. We have many actual railroad personnel in our group and working in sessions.

We have used MSTS and are soon adding sessions for TRS this month. If you are interested I would be willing to hold a Q&A session live as well as invite you to listen to one of our operating sessions. This Saturday (9/17) we will have 24 trains plus multiple dispatchers and a chief yardmaster plus Train Master working from 1 pm to 11 pm on the BNSF Clovis Sub.

The engineers range from brand new (first run) to seasoned veterans with numerous sessions under their belt. We would love to work with a dedicated group of RW owners to expand our session offerings and include this sim as well. Please visit our forum at http://vrma.proboards.com for a FAQ discussion. If you like what you see and want to learn more, please let me know either by PM here or email at vrmasto at aol.com.

Thanks for reading,

Nick C.
Superintendent Train Operations
Virtual Operators Railroad Association

[buzz456]

Gentlemen:

We already have such a group in place. We are entering our second year of running Prototype Operating Sessions on sim railroads all over US and Canada. We have trained dispatchers, yardmasters, maintenance of way, engineers, conductors, train masters and more. Our system will work on any simulator as it is not dependent upon the sim but rather the quality of the route (must be a close approximation of a Class One route) and the quality of the people involved.

All of our engineers go thorough an qualification and training program since we do follow the rule book for every road we run upon. We supply all train info (symbols, car count, weight, length. load and empty counts and more) in every session we run. We have many actual railroad personnel in our group and working in sessions.

We have used MSTS and are soon adding sessions for TRS this month. If you are interested I would be willing to hold a Q&A session live as well as invite you to listen to one of our operating sessions. This Saturday (9/17) we will have 24 trains plus multiple dispatchers and a chief yardmaster plus Train Master working from 1 pm to 11 pm on the BNSF Clovis Sub.

The engineers range from brand new (first run) to seasoned veterans with numerous sessions under their belt. We would love to work with a dedicated group of RW owners to expand our session offerings and include this sim as well. Please visit our forum at http://vrma.proboards.com for a FAQ discussion. If you like what you see and want to learn more, please let me know either by PM here or email at vrmasto at aol.com.

Thanks for reading,

Nick C.
Superintendent Train Operations
Virtual Operators Railroad Association

That's all very nice but this is a Railworks forum.

[Hawk]

That's all very nice but this is a Railworks forum.

He did mention that he was interested in working with RW owners.

[TrainMaster1]

Yes, sir aware that it is a Railworks forum. We are interested in finding RW owners who are truly interested in moving beyond multiplayer and into real world operations. That is the only reason for me being here. If I have ruffled any feathers, I apologize as that was not the intent. Our system will work on any sim any where on the planet. Just needs crews interested in being trained to run according to railroad rules and ready to have fun.

We started in MSTS because their owners approached us first and they had many prototype routes to choose from. Personally I do not own any sim and function solely as the STO for every session.

Nick

[Machinist]

Hi Nick,

I'm already registered to VORA, just waiting the approval from a staff member and VORA questionnaire.

Cheers.

* Sent a PM to you.

[Chessie8638]

I'm interested. Waiting on RW3 and I'll sign up on VORA.

[TrainMaster1]

Hello:

Machinst...email is waiting for you.

Also there is no need to wait for RW3 as what we do is not dependent upon the sim. (Other than having a number of people assembled, trained and ready to run on the same route at the same time.) Anybody who wants to listen into this Saturday's session and hear what all the action please let me know as we have a limited number of listener spaces available.

Thanks,

Nick

[Machinist]

Hello:

Machinst...email is waiting for you.

Also there is no need to wait for RW3 as what we do is not dependent upon the sim. (Other than having a number of people assembled, trained and ready to run on the same route at the same time.) Anybody who wants to listen into this Saturday's session and hear what all the action please let me know as we have a limited number of listener spaces available.

Thanks,

Nick

Hi Nick,

E-mail replied. As I'm not quite used to speaking and listening in English (especially concerning to railroad especific terms/language), because I have little experience with with TeamSpeaker3 in another train simulator, if left a vacancy you can subscribe me if you can not enroll someone who will take better advantage of the next saturday session.

Cheers, and looking forward.
Lisboa.

[Hawk]

If I have ruffled any feathers, I apologize as that was not the intent.

Don't worry about it. I think buzz just missed that part of your post.

[Kali]

I will be interested in how far RW's multiplayer abilities go. To be honest there's nothing to stop it going as far as a full world - considering we've had MMORPGs around for over a decade, massively multiplayer games are not some new tech that has to settle. The main issue would be cost of the service, I'd imagine - and depending on how big a "world" is the logistics of modelling the whole area, and making the game progressively load it. Trains travel exact known predictable paths & don't change speed at any great rate, so I don't see there being any latency issues. A lot depends on how whoever is designing the MP side sees RW itself; is it a driving simulation or a simulation of the entire network, with signallers & human controllers and so on.

[Dan]

It sounds interesting but the thing that puts me off is the time commitment. I simply don't have 2-3 hours to sit down in a block and play games.

[johnmckenzie]

It sounds interesting but the thing that puts me off is the time commitment. I simply don't have 2-3 hours to sit down in a block and play games.

Agreed. I have the same problem.