Railworks America

Some are saying what I am going to say here is just an obsession. But there is something weird indeed. I don´t think this has been discussed here before, but my quest is addressed to the scenery specialists, which I am not. So here I go.
When you are driving a loco in Soldier Summit going "uphill", the sensation you get is that it is going downhill. This only happens in Soldier Summit between the about 20 routes I have in my collection. I posted about this in DTG TS2015 forums:
http://steamcommunity.com/app/24010/discussions/3/541906989406022154/
Originally I thought the Soldier Summit syndrome was caused by some wrong value in the cabviews .bin of the route locos.
Last week I have been making mods for four of the steam locos I have (K4, Berk, Northern and FEF-3), so you can see the far away rails in front of your loco thru the internal cab view front windows.
So I checked if the cause of the SS syndrome was in those .bin cabviews. Finally I determined the phenomena had nothing to do with those.
So the cause of the downhill sensation was the scenery and not the locos cabviews.

This is my question: Are you aware of a .bin where you may change the values for the direction of the vector of the external scenery view in a particular route and how to find it?

I've noticed the same effect you've described on numerous routes and from numerous engines. In fact, I find it generally difficult to determine from the in-cab views whether the engine is heading up or down slope and I've always blamed this on the position of the cab cameras.

If the camera tilted so that the horizon was always in the middle of the screen you would easily be able to tell if you are going up or downhill. Sadly this does not happen.

-Jake

OldProf wrote:I've noticed the same effect you've described on numerous routes and from numerous engines. In fact, I find it generally difficult to determine from the in-cab views whether the engine is heading up or down slope and I've always blamed this on the position of the cab cameras.

Last week I have been making some mods with the cabview files of the steam locos: K4, Berk, SP&S and FEF-3 and I can assure you the problem can´t be solved in the cabview.bin files.
You take a loco from the Horseshoe Curve route and the uphill views will look downhill in SoldSum.
Besides if you take the D&RGW SD-40 and run it in Horshoe Curve you won´t experience the visual glitch. Uphill runs will look uphill in HC.
It must be some other view .bin that is related with the scenery of Soldier Summit.
In MSTS you could change the vector direction of the external view seen from a 2D cabview. If that existed in some TS2015 .bin it is there where it can be fixed.

Alpenfreight wrote:If the camera tilted so that the horizon was always in the middle of the screen you would easily be able to tell if you are going up or downhill. Sadly this does not happen.

-Jake

Precisely! It is a matter of the vertical position of the perspective focal point.
Some told me in the DTG forums (see link above) that in real life it seems to be some places where you may experience going downhill when you are going up. It is a psychological trick and it looks real (I have seen a video showing so). I am sure however, it is not the case in Soldier Summit and besides it could not happen inside a cab.

I can tell you all this. Some of us have known for some time, that certain cars like the Coal hoppers have very messed up physics. I mean a loaded train will go up a 1.5% grade with a couple of engines in notch 1 or 2. That's one reason I like unit oil trains when I want to drive a heavy train.
I've also noted that the physics in Quick Drive aren't as consistent as before TS 2015.

MSTS is the same you cannot tell whether you are going up hill or down hill only when you come to a part of the track that is either going up or down.

I can honestly say that I have never noticed that.

If you scroll your mouse wheel and zoom the view in you can see the gradients better. I don't suggest driving like that, just taking a peek at the terrain, then zoom back out. I do it to see the grade and to see signals in the distance.

artimrj wrote:If you scroll your mouse wheel and zoom the view in you can see the gradients better. I don't suggest driving like that, just taking a peek at the terrain, then zoom back out. I do it to see the grade and to see signals in the distance.

I would have hoped for an answer about some file hidden in Soldier Summit.

trev123 wrote:MSTS is the same you cannot tell whether you are going up hill or down hill only when you come to a part of the track that is either going up or down.

Do you mean MSTS Soldier Summit or another route? I can't remember a route with that sensation in MSTS.

I don't really see how this is an actual issue with the camera in the game. You're just getting fooled by lack of reference to a true horizon and instead your eyes are using reference of nearby roads, hills and other features which completely confuse your brain. You are also at a deficit to begin with because you only have visuals to judge.

In the screen shot you linked to, it looks perfectly normal to me. In fact I can say that picture gives me the impression of going uphill (which you were.)

jalsina wrote:

trev123 wrote:MSTS is the same you cannot tell whether you are going up hill or down hill only when you come to a part of the track that is either going up or down.

Do you mean MSTS Soldier Summit or another route? I can't remember a route with that sensation in MSTS.

I can. Marias Pass.

plethaus wrote:I don't really see how this is an actual issue with the camera in the game. You're just getting fooled by lack of reference to a true horizon and instead your eyes are using reference of nearby roads, hills and other features which completely confuse your brain. You are also at a deficit to begin with because you only have visuals to judge.

In the screen shot you linked to, it looks perfectly normal to me. In fact I can say that picture gives me the impression of going uphill (which you were.)

And the hills, roads and features do not confuse your brain in Horseshoe Curve or Donner Pass?
Besides, you forget that you loose reference as you are inside a cab.

trev123 wrote:

jalsina wrote:

trev123 wrote:MSTS is the same you cannot tell whether you are going up hill or down hill only when you come to a part of the track that is either going up or down.

Do you mean MSTS Soldier Summit or another route? I can't remember a route with that sensation in MSTS.

I can. Marias Pass.

MSTS Marias Pass, the route in the box, or another one. I have spent hours of my live in MSTS MP and never saw an uphill run that seemed going downhill.