Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby mrennie » Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:11 pm

hertsbob wrote:Makes a great deal of sense. Thanks for explaining. The whole co-ordinate relationship thing in 3D modelling has always baffled me and I've often wondered how people manage to marry up loco bodies with bogeys, etc. and now I see that actually they don't! They're all part of the same thing... !DUH!

it allows me to get something rolling along the track as soon as possible

I was so hoping you were going to say that you were driving your wheels about! !*brav*!


Yep, the entire loco is made up of bogies. In this case, three. The bogie bo02 is the set of driving wheels and everything else except for the pilot and trailing trucks.

I'll do a video of it as soon as I've finished animating the side rods !!*ok*!! (pity I'm too late for the 1st of April).
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby hertsbob » Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:34 pm

mrennie wrote:the set of driving wheels and everything else except for the pilot and trailing trucks.


Righty ho. (Clearly I am a drunken Englishman, sorry about that)

So, I can cope with the concept of most of the model being built upon the driving wheels, but how do the other trucks (I presume we're talking about the same thing, except I've never encountered a truck up my nose - thankfully) know what's happening, and where they are relative to the rest of the loco?
"Life is like a journey, taken on a train
With a pair of travelers at each windowpane.
I may sit beside you all the journey through,
Or I may sit elsewhere, never knowing you.
But if fate should mark me to sit by your side,
Let's be pleasant travellers; it's so short a ride."
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby mrennie » Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:55 pm

hertsbob wrote:
mrennie wrote:the set of driving wheels and everything else except for the pilot and trailing trucks.


Righty ho. (Clearly I am a drunken Englishman, sorry about that)

So, I can cope with the concept of most of the model being built upon the driving wheels, but how do the other trucks (I presume we're talking about the same thing, except I've never encountered a truck up my nose - thankfully) know what's happening, and where they are relative to the rest of the loco?


That's partly taken care of in the engine blueprint, which is where you tell it the position along the track of the truck centre (actually the centre of the truck's top-level group in the 3D model) relative to the entire engine. I always put the driver group at offset 0, so the pilot truck (bogie) is at a positive x offset and the trailing truck at a negative x offset. The engine blueprint uses that information to work out the physics, like the positions where things should pivot. If you get it wrong, strange things happen, like the engine wobbling about, or rearing up on its hind legs, or toppling over, or flying up in the air. Where you see the various things in the visual model is entirely down to where they are in the actual 3DC model, since you export the entire model as a single intermediate geometry file. What is absolutely vital for that to work properly is to use the correct group hierarchy and naming. For example, with the 4-8-4, the topmost group is called locomotive and it has three child groups, bo01, bo02 and bo03. Then the wheels are children of those groups - for example, in bo02, we have bo02wh01, bo02wh02, bo02wh03 and bo02wh04. These group names are cited in the bogey blueprints, where you give the offsets along the track of each axle, but again, that's just to build the Physx model - it doesn't affect where you actually see the axles in the visual model. all the parts that should be fixed to the frame (boiler, cab, etc) are in bo02.

So, it all works as long as (a) the group hierarchy is right (it's all explained in the dev docs), (b) the model is built pointing in the correct direction in 3DC (nose pointing towards the top of the screen when you look at it in plan view) and (c) you export the entire model (every group and part belonging to "locomotive") to the same, single .igs file.

The tender works the same way, except that the topmost group is called "tender".
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby hertsbob » Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:13 pm

It's taken 20 minutes, but I understand that! Thank you.

**!!bow!!**

I am constantly amazed by the incredible diversity of knowledge loco builders have to acquire. I think I'll stick to throwing track about; it's far less complicated. *!!wink!!*
"Life is like a journey, taken on a train
With a pair of travelers at each windowpane.
I may sit beside you all the journey through,
Or I may sit elsewhere, never knowing you.
But if fate should mark me to sit by your side,
Let's be pleasant travellers; it's so short a ride."
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby mrennie » Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:16 pm

hertsbob wrote:It's taken 20 minutes, but I understand that! Thank you.

**!!bow!!**

I am constantly amazed by the incredible diversity of knowledge loco builders have to acquire. I think I'll stick to throwing track about; it's far less complicated. *!!wink!!*


Hopefully next year you can teach me a trick or two !!*ok*!!
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby hertsbob » Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:51 pm

An insight into the workings of the other side of the coin, perhaps? *!!wink!!*
"Life is like a journey, taken on a train
With a pair of travelers at each windowpane.
I may sit beside you all the journey through,
Or I may sit elsewhere, never knowing you.
But if fate should mark me to sit by your side,
Let's be pleasant travellers; it's so short a ride."
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby evafan002 » Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:06 am

mrennie wrote:
Arctic Cat ZRT wrote:Seems like you're missing some locomotive !*roll-laugh*!

Its looks great! Can't wait to see more progress!


What you can't see in that shot is that the engineer and fireman are sitting in mid air in an invisible cab, and there's smoke and steam coming out from various places *!lol!*

I used the Connie's templates to get a head start and since they already include everything such as the crew, I kept them. It looks quite amusing when you see the whole lot trundling down the track.

any chance of seeing a video of this phenomenon? or is it going to stay your own little amusement?
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby mrennie » Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:57 am

hertsbob wrote:An insight into the workings of the other side of the coin, perhaps? *!!wink!!*


Now that would make a good subject for a new thread, if you're up to it . Maybe a Q&A on track laying? I'd certainly been interested.
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby mrennie » Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:58 am

evafan002 wrote:any chance of seeing a video of this phenomenon? or is it going to stay your own little amusement?


I had the exact same thought last night ... I'll do a little video *!lol!*
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby evafan002 » Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:51 am

mrennie wrote:
evafan002 wrote:any chance of seeing a video of this phenomenon? or is it going to stay your own little amusement?


I had the exact same thought last night ... I'll do a little video *!lol!*

thank you this should be good for a laugh or three *!lol!*
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby hertsbob » Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:18 pm

Looking forward to seeing your video! *!!wink!!*

I did a few tutorial-type posts over on UKTS a while back. Was this the sort of thing you had in mind? I'm more than happy to do something similar if people are interested, or to address any questions there may be. Not sure where the thread would need to go? http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic.php?f=365&t=127848&start=15#p1595597
"Life is like a journey, taken on a train
With a pair of travelers at each windowpane.
I may sit beside you all the journey through,
Or I may sit elsewhere, never knowing you.
But if fate should mark me to sit by your side,
Let's be pleasant travellers; it's so short a ride."
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby mrennie » Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:30 pm

hertsbob wrote:Looking forward to seeing your video! *!!wink!!*

I did a few tutorial-type posts over on UKTS a while back. Was this the sort of thing you had in mind? I'm more than happy to do something similar if people are interested, or to address any questions there may be. Not sure where the thread would need to go? http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic.php?f=365&t=127848&start=15#p1595597


That's the kind of thing I had in mind. I suppose we could just refer to that same tutorial, unless you fancy doing a new one. A good place for the thread would be in Scenery Design where there are already a few tutorials.

I'm finishing up the animation of the side rods and then I'll do the video. It'll be fun!
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby hertsbob » Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:08 pm

Thanks for that. I'll have a look at putting something together for RWA. That other thread is a bit cluttered!
"Life is like a journey, taken on a train
With a pair of travelers at each windowpane.
I may sit beside you all the journey through,
Or I may sit elsewhere, never knowing you.
But if fate should mark me to sit by your side,
Let's be pleasant travellers; it's so short a ride."
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Location: The Hollywood of SW Herts

Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby mrennie » Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:47 pm

hertsbob wrote:Thanks for that. I'll have a look at putting something together for RWA. That other thread is a bit cluttered!


Great !!*ok*!!

I'll save my first question for when that thread is started.
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Re: Union Pacific FEF-3 4-8-4 Northern type steam locomotive, by Smokebox

Unread postby hertsbob » Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:11 pm

No worries. Don't hold your breath though. I won't forget, but time isn't on my side at the moment.

Now then. Where's this video of yours? *!!wink!!*
"Life is like a journey, taken on a train
With a pair of travelers at each windowpane.
I may sit beside you all the journey through,
Or I may sit elsewhere, never knowing you.
But if fate should mark me to sit by your side,
Let's be pleasant travellers; it's so short a ride."
User avatar
hertsbob
 
Posts: 388
Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2011 5:15 am
Location: The Hollywood of SW Herts

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