New York Division-Bergen Line: Episode III, The Erie Rises

[AmericanSteam]

It's all in the details......

[minerman146]

AmericanSteam - it is so true.

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Several key points in the shot.
1. Its all in the details in every single object in this picture.
2. I have successfully nailed the look of the meadowlands.
3. Mainlines - EL gear is REALLY standing out in a highly detailed environment. ( I need more sir)
4. Michael Stephan getting the Erie bug was the best thing that happened to me.
5. I think I have now done every thing I wanted to do.

[AmericanSteam]

Eerily Erie.

[minerman146]

Well, that one just flew by didnt it? Looks like its time for the Wednesday Route Report and Update Status for this Friday, April 2nd, 2021.

This week's update status.


[ ] I finished the last Superfund site, now were done!
[ X ] Were gonna need some bigger landfills so, no update guys.

Yeah, I had been wanting to put this one up for a while. Paper Lace from 1974.

And no this does not mean were going to Chicago.

Over the weekend I finished up the my rework of the scenery from the Main, up past Dubois Chemical and got back to Carlstadt on Monday. And it is here that I will finish the route out. So the star of this week is custom buildings. As you know, there is where I fold, spindle and mutilate various assets and stuff comes out that sometimes actually looks like the thing I am looking at. I am methodically filling out section by section and block by block AND remembering to do some scenery detail in case I forget. The final product, not too shabby.

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You got the pictures and you get the idea. I wanted to be clear as I think I used the term "industrial switching" to mean something that is doesn't in this case. What we have is an industrial area of about 6 square miles with approximately 32 businesses that are rail served. The appropriate equipment in this area would be a 1200 or 2400 on 4 axles. A number of the curves and switches are too tight for a 3300 or 3600 and you would likely split the rail. For the kids, GP38-2 would do the job nicely. But ya dont need a 44 Tonner.

I am also trying to wrap my head around the number of cars pulled out of Croxton on one trick for Carlstadt. I see pictures of car counts of 2 to 8. If so, I am seeing multiple runs per day into the area. Interesting!

And in closing, tomorrow completes the seventh year of work on the Bergen which was born on April 1, 2014.

Carry on.

[ex-railwayman]

Alan - it is always great to hear from you! You really bring out the route with your 'touch'. I love Hoboken
On to your query
Actually the roof is correct,
Loong story short: The Erie didn't have fancy high platforms, or concrete ones for the most part. That legacy lived on through the early 1980s when Conrail/Metro North had these small stations constructed on the Bergen. Then in 1990 the Americans with Disabilities Act was signed into Federal Law. This states that all public facilities must be handicap accessible.
So, this higher platform has a lift for wheelchairs and is off course, is the same height as the car floor on the coach. The high platform gets the high roof.

Thank you very much for your explanation, Sir, I understand completely now. I do like to keep you 3rd party route developers on your toes with these searching questions.
Looking forward to your final, final route release, I can add a few personal touches on my copy knowing that it won't get spoilt by another update.

Cheerz. Steve. Not Alan.

[minerman146]

Well, I am wrapping up for the night and wanted to give a little progress report as we go into the weekend.
The NJ&NY RR ( I am no longer calling this the Pascack Line cuz its the 70s now) has 2 industrial clusters. The first, as we move North off the main is East Rutherford. The second is Carlstadt-Moonachie.

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This section has been complete for a week - down to the telephone poles and streetlights.

Next up is the big mama: Carlstadt-Moonachie.

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This last of the track was just completed tonight. There will be another 200 foot a track that I will need to lay into the last customer: The New York Times. The picture below shows the view due North.

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As with other sections of the route - this is over the top with scenery density. This is just the way it all lies. I don't believe we have anything like this along just 3 miles of branch line.

The final consignee count will be as follows on the NJ&NY:
East Rutherford: 14
Carlstadt-Moonachie 23

I will just mention that directly on the NJ&NY there are another 6 to grab. 2 are complex chemical facilities that I have decent aerial views of, but no ground level imagery. I traced out the track and frankly, I am getting a bit tired. So, I may just let that go.

Last up, this message is for PWELT. Sir, if you have any recollections of rail operations into Dubois Chemical please post them here. I want to get the traffic you had documented into the Operations Guide so we can get the right number of Potash Cars and so on, to that location. Thanks in advance.

Carry On.

[_o_OOOO_oo-Kanawha]

Looking as great as always.

There are stub tracks to the industries both in leading and trailing direction, but no run around tracks at many locations.

How were those stubs serviced, with the locomotive in the center of the cut?

[minerman146]

Operations on the NJNY RR.
1. I dont have direct knowledge of how the sidings were worked. 2. Our Chief Consultant didn't work that job and was only able to add "if you had to run backwards, you ran backwards". 3. Norfolk Southern operates here with a diesel at the head and at the end of a cut of cards ( this makes sense ). 4. EL ran with a full crew (NJ Law), so you had a diesel and a caboose working Carlstadt (I have pictures that show this).

Here is what I observe from the way the tracks lie. Once on to the NJ&NY you get 2 tracks from East Rutherford to 1000 feet before Woodridge Station. Contrail documentation shows track 1 (West/North) as owned by them and track 2 (East/South) owned by NJT. This infers exclusive or at least primary use of the track by Conrail for freight and serving of the sidings. I presume EL operated this way and I believe to a lesser extent Norfolk Southern has similar access. My observation of the track today is track 2 is concrete tied and ribbon rail, and track 1 looks like stick rail. (And by today I mean 2021) This is good in that it limits fouling of the main, with the exception of Carlstadt's "Seamans Siding" which leads right on to track 2. This is the key problem area.

As for moving your engine from the front to the end of your cut. There are 2 places you can do this: On the NJ&NY on the NJ&NY Jct siding and the Carlstadt siding. Inside Seaman's Siding, there is a documented run-around track on the East section of the "S" curve.

Opearionaly, and I know this from previous conversations with my Chief Consultant "HI DAD!" is the following.
Trains are constructed, in order, with the first cut closest to the locomotive. Looks like this for the NJ&NY: (Engine, Caboose, 1st Drop, 2nd Drop, 3rd Drop) Empties were returned semi-classified by road name, and I would presume home region as this would lessen moves in Croxton. So, the moves for fulls were planned at Croxton, prior to assembly of a cut and assignment of a crew. The conductor would have a copy of the manifest on hand and the good ones checked the ordering enroute to the destination. Next, we have to assume that this theoretical train is running less than some number of cars, say 10 maximum, looking at Carlstadt. This train would definitely be dropping of cars, moving empties out to insert fresh loaded cars, and bringing a load of cars back to Croxton which could include and cars left by other crews on the sidings.

So, to answer the question "How were those stubs serviced, with the locomotive in the center of the cut?" I would answer only briefly working the industrial sidings, as needed. I dont see them doing this on the NJ&NJ branch itself.

I would call the picture below typical of trains I have seen pictures of going to the NJ&NY

EL-Croxton-Ordinary.jpg

Conrail would be very similar except the caboose disappears in the late 80s early 90s. As far as NS is concerned, they have an engine in the front and rear of the trains and there are a number of videos out there for today's operations.

EDIT: (Link: https://youtu.be/vQVKTE8g3os )


Case in point for NS. taken on the NJ&NY. Note the unit on front and rear. Note also the train is running East on Track 1. The last few seconds of video has the the siding to Dubois Chemical on the right.

Carry on!

[Pwelt]

Hi
I had just started at DuBois so I did not know much about the switching, was just told to go out and unload the car. Later on they discontinued the deliveries by railroad and brought the soda ash in by truck. I bid on a maintenance job and did not know much about the switching.
Pwelt

[minerman146]

Hi
I had just started at DuBois so I did not know much about the switching, was just told to go out and unload the car. Later on they discontinued the deliveries by railroad and brought the soda ash in by truck. I bid on a maintenance job and did not know much about the switching.
Pwelt

I will take anything you can remember. The potash was unknown to me. Do you remember:
1. What else came in by rail or truck.
2. Did anything GO OUT (other than empties) by rail.
3. How many cars or trucks per week?

This all helps!

[minerman146]

In keeping with the retro look of the Bergen - I am finally working on getting all the signals numbered. They correspond with the 2D map and approximately and what mile on the route they are located in.

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Looks pretty good too.

[gtrtroger]

I’ve said it before......and I say it again. Truly an impressive piece of work!

[kris120]

Hi minerman142,
I've read that on many railroads a number plate converts a signal from a stopping to a restricting signal.
See there: https://www.railroadsignals.us/basics/basics4.htm (section "Flashing Aspects")
Unfortunately I do not find the rules for the EL on my harddisc to check this.
... just so you don't do all the work now, just because it looks cool ...

[minerman146]

Of the roughly 20 I have done of the top of my head I have pictures (some where) of the following;
1. Passaic Jct.
2. Port Jervis East before station
3. Port Jervis West before yard B
4. Sloatsburg East in the middle of the middle.
5. Suffern West at station.

I read the same article regarding restricted sigmals and hesitated all this time. They look really cool!

When my chief consultant reads this, please give me a call!

But the numbers look so cool...

Carry on.


.

[ErikGorbiHamilton]

We do have a good reference for ERIE signal rules. I am wondering if the EL combined both rules from the DL&W and ERIE, adopted one roads rules over another, or developed and used their own rules.

ERIE rules