SEPTA Refuses License to DTG

[drivertime61]

This is taken from a reply to comments by a poster following an article by Gary Dolzall re the upcoming NJT route on the Train Sim Home Page:

"TrainSim-Steve
9th March 2017 at 8:26 am
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us Jonathan, sadly we will be unable to represent Septa trains as they recently declined to grant us an appropriate licence."

Sad news for those of us who have been waiting patiently to see some great SEPTA route possibilities recreated in the sim. For those of you who understand these things, what could be the downside for SEPTA to give DTG the required license? A matter of money or....?

[artimrj]

Idiots posting screenshots of them crashing.

[_o_OOOO_oo-Kanawha]

I still wonder wether agreeing on licenses would have been easier for DTG if they were US based.

Dealing over this sort of things by email?

So now the community will have to do decals again, if the train will be released at all ...

[JerryC]

Worry about the possibility of terrorist using Septa licensed materials to learn how to drive and crash/destroy Septa property ( laugh but its true, as American Airlines ), worry that the licensed material will be sold in areas outside of their control, lack of monetary incentive, lack of creative control, don't want to be bothered will licensing foamer products - it can be any number of things. Most likely though is what Art said - they don't want the licensed materials to be used in a negative light.

Email is usually the first step in licensing. Most companies won't talk on the phone with you until you send them a "feeler" letting them know your intentions.

[_o_OOOO_oo-Kanawha]

This is true of any simulator that is based on real stuff. Can a person really fly a real airplane after a few rounds of FS? Probably not, but driving a train full of passengers or chemicals into a crash isn't that difficult. Even easier now that some of the start up sequences are also simulated?

Have their been cased reported of locomotives and trains getting stolen? Overhere in Europe there have, but electric trains and streetcars are brought to a halt when dispatch switches off the catenary.

[JerryC]

Ok, i'll let the already known cat out of the bag - the possibility of actually moving a locomotive using one of the more realistic simmed locos is kind of remote. Not every step is included, sometimes for this very reason.

American Airlines got more busted up over ABC news using Flight Sim to make a video of it's jets crashing into the WTC than any actual "training" the terrorists may have done.

And yes, locomotives have been stolen. Most of the time they have went to ground on the derail, but there was an incident a couple years where a disgruntled employee stole a locomotive and went a bit looney with it.

http://trib.com/news/local/crime-and-co ... 446a1.html

[_o_OOOO_oo-Kanawha]

Nowadays, it takes all kinds of PTC initialisation to perform apart from actually starting the locomotive prime mover before it can be moved.

Hijacking a train, half knowing how to drive it into a suicidal crash or inferno, the thought alone gives me the creeps.

Better drop this subject, as it might mean the end of any realistic transportation simulator.

[JerryC]

No worries. Kill the simulators, and then you still have a wealth of videos and manuals, as well as training materials that can be purchased from eBay. It is the information age, and now that the info is out there, it would be very hard to shut it down.

[BNSFdude]

You don't have to initialize PTC to get it to move.

[_o_OOOO_oo-Kanawha]

I wonder what this means to DTG's chances of securing UP licenses? The failure of DTG to acquire BNSF and SEPTA licences must spread around in the railroad business, perhaps making other companies wary to give a license of to renew a license.

No matter how Fabulous DTG proclaims CSX Sand Patch to be, eastern railroad operation of Cumberland to nowhere and back are not my main interest in US railroading.
I like the western US with ATSF, DRGW, SP, UP, WP, BNSF and such. And without a UP license ...
Does anybody remember if the UP herald was on TSW's start screen?

[JerryC]

Just striaght up, the intellectual properties lawyers at UP are idiots, and their licensing scheme for small potatos licensors is the stupidest thing i've ever seen. If I wanted to give away their shiat for free, I could do that without asking permission. Perhaps it takes folks with deeper pockets to shake loose a license there?

As for BNSF, pretty much they can't give you permission to sell outside of the U.S. because they don't own the trademark outside of the U.S. That is total hearsay, but it has been repeated over and over, and as many times as I have asked BNSF to clarrify this, they have refused to say anything about it. Now the next thing i'm going to say is going to offend, so if you get your feelings hurt easily, turn away now. BNSF is not worth the effort to get licensing from. I appreciate folks feelings about being fans of their home railroad, and I myself am a fan of Cascade Green. But in my experience, you have a few folks who lobby hard to get BNSF licensed liveries, then those few folks are the only ones that buy it! A lot of time goes into these routes and assets, if a company is going to stay fluid, then they need to go where the dollars flow. If you can't sell it outside the U.S., and only a few people there buy it, there is no point in doing it.

Maybe companies in the U.S. would be more receptive to licensing their products if DTG had a permanent office in the U.S ?

[GERUNIMO625]

Just straight up, the intellectual properties lawyers at UP are idiots, and their licensing scheme for small potatos licensors is the stupidest thing i've ever seen.

I wish I could say that only extends to those yahoos
A lot of us wonder how they've managed to keep that company running as long as they have.

[BNSFdude]

Just straight up, the intellectual properties lawyers at UP are idiots, and their licensing scheme for small potatos licensors is the stupidest thing i've ever seen.

I wish I could say that only extends to those yahoos
A lot of us wonder how they've managed to keep that company running as long as they have.

as we say "If this place didn't make money, they'd be bankrupt."

[buzz456]

UP has a pretty impressive balance sheet my friends. Just because they have idiot lawyers does not single them out. Idiot lawyers abound in the corporate world but then I am being redundant in using the terms idiot and lawyers.

[_o_OOOO_oo-Kanawha]

Maybe companies in the U.S. would be more receptive to licensing their products if DTG had a permanent office in the U.S ?

That's what I've been asking all along ...

It makes the choice of CSX for the launch edition of TSW even more curious,

To go by the general feel of the UK and German boards I visit, most are reluctant to buy the launch edition because it doesn't offer home content. DTG's promises to provide this home content aren't temping the early adopters when they have no interest whatsoever in US railroading ....

So they just wait for DTG's next moves in this. Perhaps their UK and Germany licenses also need to be renewed for the new game of TSW?